Like you said, PEOPLE is still a relatively new concept, but has it begun to grow to other circles of musicians outside of your usual collaborators? Have people reached out about it?

It’s definitely stretching well beyond us already, and there’s a lot of interest. And we’re not meant to be the leaders of it, really. We’re not the arbiters of anything. I think it’s meant to grow, artist to artist. Initially, there’s a connection made through physical events, whether it’s what’s happening in Berlin or at Eaux Claires, where it’s like, “You five musicians are together working on something. Here’s the login for this—do you wanna start posting stuff?” That’s literally all that’s gonna be happening. Not totally open yet, because we want it to grow organically through direct artist-to-artist relationships. The idea is hopefully that it would just spread well beyond us and become something that is sort of evergreen in terms of growing through that kind of artist-to-artist contact and collaboration. I would still say that if I looked at PEOPLE’s list of artists, I do know quite a few of them, and it’s still somewhat close. It’s an experiment; I have no idea what forces it will unleash. But it seems to be positive. It’s about breaking down barriers in general. I think of it being open and collaborative and having a dialogue. We don’t need walls or other people to make music together.

Is the ultimate idea to have whoever is involved just to be able to post whatever they want whenever they want?

There’s an admin, so you can’t just go live with anything. The idea is that you can use it to post whatever you want, and then someone checks it and makes sure you’ve entered all the information you need to, and then they go live with it. And also, there will be an integration with outside DSP’s and stuff, so if they want to use PEOPLE to access digital distribution, they can do that also. So it acts as an aggregator. That’s exciting.

Let’s talk about Big Red Machine, and specifically you’re relationship with Justin Vernon, which I know started with 4AD’s Dark Was the Night compilation, where Justin contributed Bon Iver’s “Brackett, WI” and you two collaborated on the track “Big Red Machine.”

Our lives and creative worlds intertwined in 2008, when we made that song, and in 2009 when Dark Was the Night came out. I think when you meet someone who you share a lot of creative energy with, which we did, there’s an openness and a collaborative spirit. He’s also a part of this big community of people that are just wonderful musicians. There’s a lot of overlap at this point, with lots of different communities, but I’ve come to know a lot of them and respect a lot of what’s going on with the Eau Claire community and the Minneapolis community, definitely through Justin. So it’s taken a lot of different forms. I think Eaux Claires was partly inspired by Music Now. Music Now has been going on in Cincinnati for almost 15 years, and it was clear—after meeting Justin and Phil and Brad Cook and Ryan Olson and Andrew Broader and Channy [Leaneagh] from Poliça, Sean Carey, all these people—it was clear all along that having an event in Eau Claire that could be a place to gather and collaborate was something that would be amazing. And that was also just another opportunity to do stuff. As you travel around as a band—and The National has played countless festivals all over the world—it’s pretty rare, actually, that somebody says, “Well, what do you wanna do? You know that crazy Grateful Dead project you did—do you wanna perform it? We can give you rehearsal space and fly everybody in for a week so you could do that.” That’s what Eaux Claires is all about, having those opportunities, and that’s very rare. All anybody really wants is for you to show up and play your hit songs and get on your way. Which is great, and we have a lot of fun doing it, but it’s important to make space for other things.

That was one of the things that also led to PEOPLE, just looking for opportunities to try things and get outside of the norm. Justin is definitely someone that’s very creative outside of Bon Iver and always has been. Bon Iver is kind of a specific stream of consciousness that is obviously so special but, as a musician, he’s extremely versatile. And so are most people I know; so are most musicians. Imagine Jerry Garcia if he hadn’t played bluegrass and in the Jerry Garcia Band and produced weird records. He was a tireless sort of creative person, and I think most musicians, most artists, are like that. That’s been the connection we all have had, and there’s been a lot of cross-pollination of ideas and people playing on each other’s records and all that. And Day of the Dead and Dark Was the Night and all these other projects come from the same source.

_Big Red Machine (photo by Graham Tolbert)_

Especially with this year’s Eaux Claires, it seems like that festival is all in on that idea of getting away from your regular band stuff and trying new things—aside from also offering sets from The National or Bon Iver, the bigger names in the lineup. What does that festival look like going forward?

Eaux Claires is definitely constantly evolving. I think that this year, we wanted to get away from having so many traditionally presented headliners and bands playing their stuff and have the focus be on the artists-in-residence. We had around 54 artists who came in and worked the week before and were involved in lots of different shows and collaborations, all kinds of people getting up and doing things together that were brand new. And I think maybe some of the communication about it could have been better, but to me, artistically, there were so many highlights, and probably some of my favorite shows I’ve ever been a part of or witnessed. I can’t say which direction it’s gonna go, because I think we are still thinking about it. But I think, in a way, that Eaux Claires has its own sort of spirit. Like PEOPLE, Eaux Claires has its own feeling and identity. But in terms of what form that takes on the ground, in terms of where and how things are staged and who plays, I think it can evolve and it can take forms. And it shouldn’t always have to do with The National or Bon Iver and Justin. And if that means it gets really small and then it gets really big and then it gets medium and then it’s in the winter—I think that would be interesting. But, again, I don’t know. I think it’s sort of a question mark at the moment.

So you’re involved with Eaux Claires and Music Now, and then The National has the new There’s No Leaving New York in Queens later this year. Is that something that will return yearly, or is it more of a one-off gathering?

The one in New York, I wouldn’t call it a festival. I just call it a great show. So no, I don’t think it’s a yearly thing. We just loved playing Forest Hills Stadium—it felt like an intimate gig even though it’s big. It’s special, and then there’s the legacy of all the old shows there. It just feels like a really amazing place to see music, and it was great on stage. So I think the idea was to see if some friends can do it and to make it a two-day thing as a way to play New York again. I’m so excited about it, but I don’t think it’s something that’s a yearly sort of thing. And with any of these events that we’re involved with, I also think the intent isn’t necessarily that it has to happen more than once, or every year. It’s more like, if you’re in a band, and generally a musician, how do you wanna spend your time? And usually, for us—and for a lot of people I know—we have the opportunity to bring friends together and to have experimental music and new music and maybe some music that’s gotten popular. That’s a very great thing because, again, it’s not the norm. So we all as a community, a big group of us—and it’s growing—are seeking out this breaking down of barriers between traditional presentation versus experimental presentation. Like at Eaux Claires, a lot of the stages are hand-built and architectural, and we’re getting more and more away from the usual presentation. I think that it’s not just a reaction to what’s out there in the world, but maybe it’s part of it. It’s sort of trying to create intimacy within and breakdown the walls between the performer and the audience a little bit more and create something that feels more connective and more sustainable. That’s why it seems like a lot of these events are connected, because it’s just different people in different places around the world trying to have a similar energy and do things like this. And it’s a great thing.

What’s the plan with the residency and public shows at the Funkhaus in Berlin, with the artists coming in and the audience? I’m curious about the logistics of the whole thing.

This year, it’s 200 artists instead of 100, and I think it’s meant to be a big birthday celebration for PEOPLE, ‘cause now that there’s a platform, it’s coming into the world a little bit. Logistically, it requires a lot of coordination, because the residency will be over 30 recording studios going at the same time, and then with the public performances on the weekend, there’ll be many different small and larger spaces that need production and coordination, too. There’s a whole team that’s focused on that. The interesting thing is that no artists are paid. We bring everyone, pay for travel and lodging, but it doesn’t make money—that’s not the point. The point is the work and the time and space that people have to create with each other, to have a dialogue, and what comes out of that is very viable. Each artist comes away with new material and new energy that allows them to go forward in interesting and sometimes unexpected ways, and I know that it’s worth a lot. That’s why so many people have been so enthusiastic to come, and we’re so thankful. And again, I don’t think of it as a hierarchical thing that’s led by anyone. It’s more of a collective this year. I’m kind of looking forward to just listening. I’m sure I’ll play some music, but last time I played 10 or 12 concerts a day, and this time I’m thinking maybe I wanna watch 10 or 12 concerts a day. So we’ll see.

We hope to capture a lot of music that will then go up on the platform—anything from rehearsals to finished work and live recordings. It’s also a nod to the bootleg culture and all that. That’s a whole world that’s so interesting and so important, and I think maybe some communities don’t embrace it as much as me. Obviously it’s a big part of the jam world, but not in other kinds of music—but it could be.

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