What made me ask that is you seem to pay tribute to ‘John Wesley Harding’ on ‘Keeper of the Key’ with ‘John Hardy’s Wedding’ into ‘Wicked Messenger,’ which was on ‘John Wesley Harding.’
‘John Hardy’s Wedding’ was the first tune where I actually sent Hunter some changes. It was after I left New Riders in ’82. I called him up one time and said, ‘Have you got any lyrics for me?’ And he said, ‘Send me some changes, some music.’ So I just got down with this little cassette tape recorder and composed a little piece of music and did overdubs with the playing. He thought it sounded a little bit like ‘The Ballad of John Hardy.’ You know, ‘John Hardy was a desperate boy.’ That’s an old Appalachian folk song. So he wrote it on the subject of John Hardy getting married.
I love songs that have a story. It’s like watching a movie.
Then it goes right into another good story song, ‘Wicked Messenger.’ You guys all have similar music heads with these incredibly entrenched roots that you can tap into. ‘Visions Under the Moon’ has a couple of good story songs too, ‘Fable of a Chosen One’ and ‘Road to Armageddon.’
They’re both weird in a good, Dylanesque kind of way. Comment on how you were inspired to write them.
With ‘Armageddon,’ I called Hunter up at a time when he was getting away from writing lyrics. I guess Mickey (Hart) must have tapped him out. He made him write, like, 12 songs. He kept saying, ‘No, no. I’m really not into it right now. I’ve got nothing.’ I was like, ‘Oh man, I need some new songs. I’ve got some good musical ideas.’ He says, ‘Well, you always liked words,’ which I do. We always had wordplay going on since day one. He said, ‘Why don’t you write some lyrics. Give it a try.’ So I did, but it’s the hardest thing I ever tried to do. It’s like, ‘Oh man, how do you think of something has some substance to it and yet is something that you’re going to feel comfortable singing over and over and over again.’ When that thought occurs to you, you might as well put the pen down and call it a night because it’s just going to overwhelm you and then you can’t think of anything. If you’re trying, you can’t do it. I’d try night after night and came up with dreck. And then I read an interview with Elmore Leonard, one of my favorite writers.
He wrote ‘Three Kings.’
And ‘Out of Sight’ and ‘Get Shorty.’ This magazine interviewer asked, ‘What is it like to write?’ And he was saying the same thing I’m saying. It’s really difficult to come up with a keeper, a good idea. So the guy says, ‘Well what’s a good day’s work for you? How much do you write?’ He says, ‘I do it about eight hours a day.’ So he asks, ‘What’s good productivity for you.’ And he says, ‘About two paragraphs.’ And I just went, ‘Hallelujah! OK, I’m on the right track. I’m doing OK.’
I figured if I could get a line a day. But it was just work, work, work, work, work. It took about a month to do it. I called Hunter up and complained. He was like, ‘It’s good. Keep it up. It gets like a muscle. Keep doing it and you’ll get better at it.’
But it’s got to be interesting for me. I’ve got an overactive mind. I dread the threat of being bored. So I have to keep it interesting. That’s why I learned to sing ‘Panama Red’ backwards, to keep it interesting. (Proceeds to sing ‘Panama Red’ backwards). The melody and the words are backwards. I taped it, turned it over on a multi-track recorder, studied it and learned how to sing it backwards. I just do that for a goof to keep it interesting.
Have you ever played that for Peter Rowan?
Yeah, I have. I said to somebody else, ‘He’s spinning over in his grave even though he’s not dead yet’ (laughs).
You’re going to tour with him a little bit. Tell me about that.
I’m really looking forward to it. We all like Peter Rowan’s music and everything. We’re thrilled to have him playing on the same bill. We thought we should open for him. He’s going to do solo acoustic.
Will he sit in?
I hope so. Yeah.
Where will that be?
It’s in Texas.
Now Bill Laymon was in New Riders. What his role?
He was the bassist, one of many. I left in ’82. He did a stint from 1988 to ’91. I think I met him in ’91.
So you weren’t in New Riders together. How does David Nelson Band sound like New Riders of the Purple Sage and how does it not sound like them?
When we use pedal steel. Barry doubles on pedal steel. I think we sound a like them because it’s similar instrumentation. Although Mookie’s keyboard influence is different. New Riders never had a regular keyboard player. Also, I wrote the song ‘No Souvenirs’ on ‘Visions’ right after I left the New Riders. A friend of mine, Earl Stillson had some words, and I put music to it. I always thought that sounds like a New Riders song. That was the song that was destined to be a New Riders song, but it was born a little too late, that’s all.
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