Photo by Susan Skidmore
Andrew Altman is best known as the bassist of New Jersey roots/jam outfit Railroad Earth, but he’s also a songwriter at heart. During some recent downtime, Altman entered the studio with American Babies/Brothers Past/Joe Russo’s Almost Dead guitarist Tom Hamilton to lay down a set of new, original numbers under his own name. The result is a self-titled EP that feels spiritually connected to the bassist’s work with Railroad Earth but also nods to his interests in modern Americana and indie.
“My time as a bassist has afforded me many things. An intimacy with other people’s music is certainly one of them, but these songs reflect the beginnings of an intimacy with one’s own thoughts,” Altman says of the new EP. “They’ve always been there, just never had the time to be hatched. Some of these songs were written in a matter of minutes and some over the course of years, but no matter their age, a time comes when they have to be kicked out of the nest.”
Shortly after the EP’s release, Altman spoke with Relix and Jambands.com about his solo project, Railroad Earth’s new live DVD and how he ended up recording with Warren Haynes.
Let’s start by talking about the original idea behind Railroad Earth’s new Red Rocks DVD. Did the band always plan to record the DVD at Red Rocks?
The Red Rocks thing came together very naturally. We were going to film the shows—we filmed the year before, too. We used NoCoast, the same people who did this DVD, and we liked the way it came out. We just used them for promo videos the previous year. [This year] they had a bigger production package, so we were like, well, let’s go with this and see what it comes out with. And we liked some of the footage, so we said maybe we should just press this thing. And the fact that the show ended up selling out, and we had the horns, it just sort of came together, really. We were just trying to do something new at Red Rocks there, as far as bringing out the horns. We played a few times, and we just want to try to give people a different experience every time, and it just so happened we had the film crew there and everything, and everyone showed up.
The best concert recordings are really about capturing the moment there.
Right, actually that’s a good point. Because I think if we would’ve been like okay guys, let’s make a DVD of Red Rocks, it probably would’ve been terrible. [Laughs.] We just thought, let’s just film this, and when we got on stage we didn’t think we were going to release it as a DVD, so I don’t think people were [thinking about it]. I know that happens to me sometimes—I’d be thinking okay, this is going to be filmed, so we got to play great. And you’re thinking about that and not playing great.
Shifting from the DVD to the EP, we were psyched to hear that Tom Hamilton was involved. I know you’ve played with him in American Babies. Can you talk a little bit about your decision to record, when you started working on this batch of songs and how Tom got involved?
Yeah, I’ve been sitting on these for a little while. I studied the whole bass thing pretty heavily when I was younger. I played jazz and really tried to get around both the electric and the upright bass. After a certain point, when you find yourself playing in bands that are really about songs, and not just about shredding the bass, you reach a point where you think, I feel pretty good about everything I have on this instrument—I need a new challenge.
That’s the whole point of what I love about music, just growing everyday, having something that you can improve and get better. So I was like, “Well, I’m not a great singer”—of course this was years ago—“Let me work on that, let me write some tunes.” This is something where I’m almost a beginner again, you know—like I said, when I started, years ago. And it was fun to have something new to challenge myself with. Now, after what were probably six or seven years, I had some tunes, and I wanted to record them. It’s hard to get players together, with my schedule and their schedule, and I had tried a few times and nothing every really happened. I found out Tom was really the driving force behind the American Babies record, and I like the way they sound. I was like, “Dude, I’m going to send you the songs, and you tell me what to do.” [Laughs]
In terms of the songs that actually made it on the EP, over how many years were they originally conceived?
I would say they were all written over the space of a couple years for sure. And I sent him like ten, and that was part of the producer thing—I was just like, pick the ones you feel the most strongly about. And those are the ones that eventually [got] on there.
Tom, like you, has played jazzy, out-there stuff as well as more songwriter-driven material. How did he and you first connect, and can you talk about your working relationship—him as producer, and you being the musician/writer in this situation?
The thing that really connected us was discovering his background and influence in music when I went out with American Babies. I met him through Dave Butler. American Babies opened for Railroad Earth, and then Dave and I would get together and play a little bit, just messing around, jamming and stuff. And they didn’t have a bass at one point, and I was off, and I was like, “I’ll play with you guys, that sounds fun, whatever, just to do something.”
So, riding around—we did a little tour—riding around and talking to Tom and listening to American Babies records, I figured he was not really like a jam dude, because they don’t really sound like that. But we’re in the van, you know, we’re listening to the modern stuff—more like indie rock and stuff—but then he’s listening to a lot of the Grateful Dead and stuff and I’m like, “Really?” I don’t hear that in the records, and that’s kind of the point. That’s how I am—I grew up listening, as a kid, to a lot of the jam stuff, but if you want to play music, you can’t just listen to one thing, you know, and I had to put it away for a while and kind of get my thing together as a musician. And when I had opportunities to play in bands that were doing that kind of thing, I was like, “Oh, I get this. I used to love this shit.” So I was able to draw on that. And he’s very much the same way, you know, grew up with all that stuff, but I wouldn’t say that it’s the bulk of what he listens to now, so we had sort of a similar thing there.
Can you talk about the recording process—who was involved, how long it took, where you recorded?
That was another great experience from working with him—it totally changed my perspective. And it’s almost a no-brainer kind of situation once it happened, but you don’t think of it, as a bass player and traditionally a side guy. I was always of the school where you go and you get your players together and you rehearse, and you try to nail it, and then if you want more overdubs, you just sort of add what’s missing. So I figured we’d be bringing in players, sort of doing it that way. But I got there [and] he just sort of hands me the guitar, and it’s like, well I wrote them on guitar, so I can play, but Tom’s obviously more of a guitar player than I am. He hands me the guitar, he’s like “Play the song.” I’m like, “Uh, I thought you were going to play guitar.” He’s like, “Just do it, don’t worry about it.” [Laughs].
The whole record kind of went that way. He would sit down at the drums and be like, “No you’re going to play drums.” [Laughs] There were some keyboards and I said, “Maybe we needed like a piano or something.” Then he said, “Oh yeah, okay,” and then he would pull a keyboard out and just play some stuff. So it was just me and him. I played some guitar, I played bass. Tom played a lot of guitar, keyboards. He even played bass on a song because he came up with a part I liked, and I was like, “There you go, I don’t have to play bass.”
That’s cool. Kind of reminds me of the old school approach where a musician would come in and play a variety of instruments themselves and not worry about what instrument they’re known for, or what necessarily would be interpreted as the live band version of it.
That is exactly how it went down, and that’s really cool, honestly. I love that approach, but it’s just something—being a guy who has always been in bands—it’s something that never occurred to me. It sounds really simple, and really dumb, and it actually kind of is. You go in there, and you just start throwing stuff at the wall, and if it sticks and you like the way it sounds, then that is all that matters. If it sucks, then you delete it and do it again, and if you can’t do it then you hire someone, or get some friends to come in. Tom is really great at that. He’s got that confidence to not worry about it. There were a lot of cool accidents that happened because of that where we were just playing stuff and it would end up being a part when he was really just figuring out the song.
Where did you guys end up recording?
We recorded it with Pete Tramo in his studio in Philadelphia. You know where the Underground Arts venue is? It’s in the basement of it—it’s called Lorelei Studios. It’s his name for it, but it’s part of the Underground Arts thing going on there. It was in a small, little place, but it had everything you need. That was another great thing about it, because he gave us a great deal. The recording process was an open-ended thing for the most part, because it was only five songs, and we would go in and work on and off it until we were done. It was like one or two days a month over six or seven months, and we would go down there and we would mess around with the tune and Pete just put things together. He played bass, he’d play drums, and he would add a part here and there.
You mentioned a lot of the older band touchstones that you and Tom are influenced by. Can you talk about some of the more modern influences that you felt influenced the album, your songwriting and your working relationship with Tom?
Yeah I mean, people think that when you’re in an acoustic band that you’re just a huge bluegrass fan and listen to all that stuff—and I listen to my share of bluegrass stuff—but when you do that all the time, the things that inspire you become the things outside of your world. Probably [at] the time I was writing a lot of these songs five years ago, I was listening to a lot of My Morning Jacket, Wilco—and I’ve known Ryan Adams for a long time. That kind of stuff. So that theme was really what was influencing these songs. And then [Tom] has definitely been in that sort of listening mode for more of his adult life, too. His thing was, back when Radiohead came out, it was like “This is something totally different,” and that’s what he was kind of going for. So we connected, but I wasn’t as big of a Radiohead fan as him. But it’s certainly that mentality where he will be listening to the jam stuff and then put it away. That stuff inspires you because you don’t do it, you know? I don’t play in a rock band like My Morning Jacket, so it’s like really cool to listen to, and really inspiring. So we share that kind of listening to things in that world.
In your work with Railroad Earth, you have written songs for them and in group settings. Was there ever a point where you brought these songs to the band, or did they all feel like something separate and different that you wanted to keep for yourself?
Actually, it’s kind of a bit of both. Some of these—before I even recorded them—I presented to the band when we were talking about material, and they didn’t really come to together for a bit during rehearsal time. But at the same time, we did one of my songs, which is on The Last of The Outlaws record. It was very much the same thing. I did not write it for the band, but I just like writing and challenging myself and having fun creating things, which I do when I am at home.
So the band is jamming or doing something in a rehearsal and it sounds like something I already have, and I go, “Oh is this my work?” And they try to get other people to try to contribute. So it then becomes a Railroad Earth thing, and that’s always the goal. Now that there’s final versions of these tunes, there are a couple that would work well with the band. I want to go to them and be like, “Hey check this out,” but then ask, “Is this something that we can add to, do it different and make for the band, so it’s relevant to the band?” And not like, “Okay, just taking break from our regular Railroad programming so our bass player can do a song, and now back to doing what we do.” No, the goal is always to have everything sound like the band.
What has playing in Railroad Earth taught you about songwriting and being a songwriter in general?
Oh man, that’s been great, of course because that’s Todd’s thing. He comes from the background of being a songwriter first and foremost, and I feel like he is really growing into his own as a lead guitar player. I’m always pushing him to do that, because I love his lead sounds, but I don’t think it’s something he’ll do. Some guys were maybe guitar players first and then kind of learned how to sing, like me with the bass—I was always a bass player first and I’m learning this other side of it. So yeah, it’s a great influence on me, because Todd has a good knack for taking a personal sentiment and putting it away to universal, which the Dead did well. And all the great songwriting that there is always, I feel, does that—takes a personal thing and makes it so anyone can go, “Oh yeah, me too. I get that.”
I think it’s cool that Railroad Earth has become his vehicle as the band has evolved over ten years now. It has become all these different voices within the whole idea.
Yeah, for sure. So it’s been a great influence to be around that, to be in a group where a lot of things do start with a song, and then everyone can contribute what they do to it to make it sound better and the way we want it. If Todd has a really great song with a specific focused thing, sometimes we’ll just stay out of the way with that one. Let’s just play our parts and not get cute with it, because it’s going to stand on its own.
I saw you recently perform with Warren Haynes at Sleep No More at The McKittrick Hotel. That was a great performance. It was cool to see the band with Warren, him doing a solo and then you guys coming on stage, and at the end it’s Railroad Earth and him blending and previewing some stuff from the new album, which was pretty awesome.
Yeah, that was a really fun thing. I heard that there’s going to be more of that. We’re working on it right now to put together some shows. It’s just working out the logistics, and of course everyone’s schedule and things. Warren Haynes: the hardest working man in the business. [Laughs] You got to catch him while you can.
Was your first time playing with him at the Capitol Theatre a few years ago, or was it at DelFest?
I think the first time for any of us was at DelFest. It was me, Tim and Andy. Yeah, just a few of us played at DelFest and it’s kind of grown slowly from there. I guess he had a good time with it, so then we did the Capitol Theatre gig. It turned into what it is now when he said he was looking to do a record. We have been in the studio with him, and he’s been trying to do this record for five years and wanted to do it with Levon and a lot of these other heavy luminaries, so it’s pretty funny to see him and say, “How did I end up here?” [Laughs]
The songs that I heard at that one show kind of reminded me of that Appalachian music from near where Warren grew up in North Carolina. It’s kind of funny how, in his new hometown of New York, playing with a band based in the Northeast, he came back and revisited the music that was part of his youth.
Yeah, that’s one of the weirdest things about Railroad Earth in general. [Laughs] Like, everywhere we go, people would be like, “Ah man, you guys are from Colorado right?” Then I say, “Uh…no?” Then they’re like, “Oh yeah, so then Northern California right?” “Still no.” Then they might ask, “Oh then you definitely have to be from Georgia.” Then I say again, “No.”
In terms of your solo work, are you planning on doing any dates under your own name or, like you said, showcasing these songs through Railroad Earth and your other projects?
Yeah, I mean I have been doing small things here and there, but I definitely want to get into more of a thing where I can do short runs, something that’s worth a little bit more notoriety, getting out a little bit and playing with some other artists from other bands who do projects of their own and that kind of thing. I don’t have anything planned right now, because the biggest problem in Railroad Earth is that it’s a super full-time thing. We play at least between 70 to 90 shows a year, so it’s a bit tricky to find dates. Then all my friends that I like to play with outside the band are in very busy working bands, too. When you get one weekend off at the same time it’s kind of a miracle, so you work around that. So we’ll see.
I’m trying to get my head around the best way to sort of get there, but for now, like I said, putting out the record and doing the songs are just to document and challenge myself, because it’s fun to do. Eventually there will be more shows and stuff, but the kind of music I like to make is heavy on improvisation, so taking these songs and developing them really requires a rapport. You can’t really just throw it together, so that’s the other hard part—figuring out and doing this sort of thing. Where if I am trying to replicate the record live exactly, that would be a lot easier. You could call people up and play it exactly. But when you’re trying to improvise a bit and stretch things out, it requires a bit more time and trust. I’m still trying to figure out the best way to do that with everyone being so busy. [laughs]
I saw a video clip that where you guys were playing in a cool setting with violinists and like a whole string section. Where was that recorded, and how did it come about?
Oh yeah! Well actually the genesis for that was really from you guys, Relix. You guys do the in-the-office or on-the-roof sessions/video thing, and we’ve done them before. We thought maybe we could do something a little bit different with this. We thought we could do one on a roof at night, but there were sound issues and all those things. So we decided to try and do this thing where we play our songs in front of a sort of non-live audience. So we did this at the Castle Inn, which is this abandoned hotel thing or something like that. Tim would know more about that, because he lives in Strasburg, Pennsylvania, where it is. We went there at night, had some lights set up, and we brought in a string quartet. We just did a few takes of some of the new stuff. It really sounded good with strings. So, again, I got to credit Relix for inspiring the idea to do this, while looking to do something different with it. Eventually it is going to be premiered through Relix, but we’re in the editing process right now.
